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Ever Onward Podcast
The Ever Onward Podcast is your go-to business podcast, offering engaging discussions and diverse guests covering everything from business strategies to community issues. Join us at the executive table as we bring together industry leaders, experts, and visionaries for insightful conversations that go beyond the boardroom. Whether you're an entrepreneur or simply curious about business, our podcast provides a well-rounded experience, exploring a variety of topics that shape the business landscape and impact communities. Brought to you by Ahlquist.
Ever Onward Podcast
Red Aspen’s 850% Growth and the Woman Behind It: Jesse McKinney’s Incredible Journey | Ever Onward - Ep. 42
Join us on a captivating journey with Jesse McKinney, the dynamic CEO and co-founder of Red Aspen. From navigating the tumultuous waves of the 2008 financial crisis to spearheading a company that empowers women across the nation, Jesse's story is one of grit and resilience. Her narrative is interwoven with personal tales of strength and triumph, inspiring listeners to embrace their own challenges and emerge victorious.
In this episode, we uncover the secrets behind Red Aspen's explosive 850% growth during the pandemic, fueled by bold innovation and strategic risk-taking. Jesse recounts how the company evolved from humble beginnings in Boise, drawing inspiration from the support of influential mentors and the interconnectedness of aspen trees. With a determination to overcome limited resources, she and her co-founders built a vibrant network of 14,000 independent consultants, creating opportunities for women to thrive. This episode is not just a business tale; it's a testament to the power of collaboration, tenacity, and daring to dream big.
As we explore themes of technological innovation and personal growth, the episode wraps up with a heartfelt conversation on motherhood and work-life integration. Jesse shares her experiences balancing the demands of entrepreneurship with family life, offering valuable insights on finding harmony and grace amid life's competing priorities. Through personal stories and empowering messages, we remind listeners that with courage and confidence, they too can tackle life's toughest challenges and achieve greatness. Tune in for a rich blend of business acumen, personal anecdotes, and an uplifting message that you're stronger than you think.
Joining Jesse on the podcast is Ryan Cleverley, COO and CFO of Ahlquist, who shares a funny yet costly story about an unexpected touchdown pass that made for an unforgettable Alabama football game experience. We’ll also explore how the new Micron facility is reshaping Boise’s tech landscape, driving demand for talent and housing, along with the latest economic trends and a commercial real estate update, shedding light on the impacts to the local market.
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Today on the Ever Onward podcast, we have Jesse McKinney, ceo and co-founder of Red Aspen. Red Aspen began in 2017 here in Idaho. It's a great Idaho company and it has been a juggernaut. It is now on track to have $40 million in revenue. Under Jess's leadership, red Aspen has been named by Inc as one of the fastest growing companies in the country. The last three years in a row, she was awarded the Idaho Business Review 2021 CEO of Influence. She's involved in the community. Her company is exploding and it's going to be really fun to hear the story and gain a lot of insights from her on business. Prior to Jess joining us, jesse joining us today, we'll have Ryan Cleverley with our Allquist update. Ryan is the COO and CFO of Allquist. Ryan Cleverley how you doing? Hey, let's start with the most important thing yeah, chase's touchdown pass last night.
Speaker 2:It was an expensive one.
Speaker 1:So just a second. We have big-time guests in from out of town Dinner last night. It's the most important dinner in a long time and you can't go because of a football game. So that sets the stage.
Speaker 3:Football and volleyball back to back, but yeah, so tell us about, tell us about the game well, I'll back up real quick.
Speaker 3:So this, this particular middle school has not won a game in like four years. Last year they scored one touchdown on offense. And I'm thinking, okay, these poor kids. So my son and his best friend are trying to figure out how to get to an Alabama football game and I said, well, you guys can't afford to do it, it's too expensive. You got to go across the country. They're like, oh, we're going to wash cars, we're going to do all this stuff. I'm like great, you're still not going to be able to do it. Um, so I said I'll tell you what. Why, let's make a deal if you throw a touchdown pass chase your son's a quarterback.
Speaker 1:He's the quarterback.
Speaker 3:Ted's the receiver he's the receiver, but he may not play that much but he plays more defense than offense. All right, I said, but it's pretty safe, pretty safe bet, super safe bet. They scored one touchdown last year in the whole season and lost every game and lost every game. Like this isn't gonna happen. If you throw a touchdown pass, I will take you both to an alabama football game. So now we're a scrimmage and four games into the season 24 to 18, they're losing and down by six, three minutes left 13 yard line coach puts ted in.
Speaker 3:I'm like, uh-oh, did you think that I did? I saw him go in the game like why are they putting ted in the game?
Speaker 1:ted doesn't play offense ted's probably not gonna catch the ball anyone.
Speaker 3:Two two plays the whole game chase, fakes a handoff, rolls out to the right and I'm seeing this unfold. I'm like, oh, there's gonna get expensive. Real quick. Ted's wide open in the end zone, throws the pass touchdown they go crazy they go crazy not because they're winning a game in for the first time in four years. They get to the sideline. They're like alabama, baby I'm. I'm like, oh word, I'm done.
Speaker 1:I looked Great game's coming up. It's going to cost you some dough. It's going to be fun.
Speaker 3:There is the Mercer game. I'm kind of thinking that maybe that's going to be the one that we have to go to you talk about kissing your sister.
Speaker 1:You win the game.
Speaker 3:And then your dad says hey, we're going to Mercer.
Speaker 1:I get to make the rules of the deal here. I've got my money on chase. Hey, one other quick thing for the update. You were on a panel yesterday. Talk a little bit about what you heard economy, what people were saying.
Speaker 3:Yeah, great great symposium that CBRE put together. I was on a panel with a really good group of people, but there were other speakers there that did a nice job. The one before us was very interesting. It was kind of a debt equity market update, with a number of different groups, a couple of lifecos, a couple other funds that do a lot of debt, and you could feel the desire to lend money. And it's there. I mean you see the 50 basis point drop in the rate by the Fed. You see the short-term SOFR rate now trending downward. I think instead of an inverted yield curve, you're starting to see it's going to normalize, which is everybody saying we're not going to be in a recession. So all those factors play into it. And you've got groups that are saying, hey, we want to lend, but we want to lend in multifamily, industrial, maybe retail, for the right deal. And then all of it really comes back down to what's your return on cost?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Which we know that Intuitively, you just know you've got to hit a return on cost. That's going to make sense with where the money is being lent at. And so if we're borrowing, you know if we can get to a point where we can borrow in the mid fives, maybe that makes sense. And so the spreads are going to be really important where they're going to get more competitive. I mean, if you're looking even to spread over a 10 year, then maybe we get into that mid five range on some of these deals. I think office is probably a 300 basis point spread and they're looking at 50 to 55% loan to value.
Speaker 1:And you're like oh okay, I don't know if I I guess the good news is there's not going to be a lot of people competing in our market.
Speaker 3:No, there will. Nobody will compete, nobody will build an office building. But there are groups out there that are still looking at office deals. So we you know we could potentially do something there, but the reality is we need to be able to look at a lot of different uses and a lot of different markets. They're super excited about Boise and then you just look demographically at what's happening in our valley with Boise and I think that the trends are really good.
Speaker 3:I think if you took Micron out of the mix, it could be an interesting time for Boise. It would be a different story. Yeah, I think that that's going to give us some stimulus that will help us in the next five to ten years. That if you stripped it out, I mean we could be facing some different headwinds just because of cost of housing and do mortgage rates come back into a place and you'll probably talk more on that in upcoming podcasts too but it's an interesting time for the housing market. Kind of what Jerome Powell said we can lower rates, but we can't just solve the housing problem. You've got to increase supply, supply, supply, right? Yeah?
Speaker 1:Great update. Anyways, chase, if you're listening, man, I love you.
Speaker 3:Great pass.
Speaker 1:Chase will never listen to this hey.
Speaker 3:I didn't even tell you this, but my daughter was. She was one of the finalists for player of the week on the Idaho Statesman, too, had a great week last week, so I gotta, I gotta, just throw that out to her too. God bless their mother's DNA, you know what the kids got mom's athletic ability, because I still have mine, not true?
Speaker 1:thanks.
Speaker 3:Thanks.
Speaker 1:Thank you for coming on today. We were telling great stories already, so I thought we might as well start.
Speaker 2:Might as well start.
Speaker 1:So I can't wait to get into you, but you were saying that you worked at Scentsy.
Speaker 2:I did work at Scentsy it was such an amazing place and we moved in to one of your buildings because we were saying Lehman pulled your loan and our CFO, matthew, was at Lehman. He was working there the day. Everything imploded so he was like there packing up your CFO currently or current CFO. Yeah, it's not wild. Gosh full circle, it's wild but I'm going to like.
Speaker 1:It's all. It's going to be about you, I promise you. But this is like a crazy story that I've never told on anywhere until it came up today. But or so, um, we were building that project out. It was my first thing ever. I was still an ER doctor. Lehman Brothers shuts down and I remember getting a call from my partner saying, hey, we're screwed, it's, it's over. So it stayed there, it's still in the air. And then I'll never forget Orville Thompson was, since he was just taken off.
Speaker 1:Totally, it was a wild time and I called him and I said hey, you're going like crazy when you come into my building. I, I'm, I'm in trouble.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And he the long. The short story is he leased three floors when he didn't have to. Oh my gosh Signed a long-term lease, allowed me to get financing finished the building and then you moved in and it was a beautiful building for him for a while, until they built their campus.
Speaker 2:He knew he was going to build his campus and he still came in, oh my gosh, and we needed the space. I remember that.
Speaker 1:Yes, and Orville and Heidi are just two of my favorite people in the whole world. You were down in that little warehouse by our CLA.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we were right there. We needed some more space. Jessie, let's start. Yeah. What a juggernaut you've been part of right, oh my gosh, it's been a wild ride, has it been?
Speaker 1:crazy.
Speaker 2:Bananas.
Speaker 1:So I've had a couple people on here and they all have said you need to get Jessie on, you need to hear the story.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, you need to hear what's going on.
Speaker 1:So thank you, and the company Just give us a little bit of background.
Speaker 2:So my name is Jessie McKinney and I'm really proud to serve as the CEO at Red Aspen. I launched Red Aspen with my two amazing business partners, Jeannie Reese and Amanda Moore. We launched in a little teeny, tiny apartment in October of 2017 in downtown Boise. We had a mission, which is to inspire women to stand up, stand out and stand together by uniting passion with purpose. We had a big dream and we had no money, none. We didn't have anything. Jeannie had moved. She's my sister, she had moved up from Colorado and she rented an apartment in downtown Boise and really that's where we got started. Those were our humble beginnings. Yeah, it was kind of a wild ride.
Speaker 1:I'm going to stop you a few times so tell there's gotta be a little bit more to tell us tell us a little bit of the origin and what's going on behind this launch before you get rolling.
Speaker 2:Totally so. Um, amanda, my partner and I we met at Scentsy had just like the best experience there, such a great experience we had both left. I was thinking about what I wanted to talk to you about today, and I want to talk about motherhood today, and actually it's funny because my story starts with motherhood. I had left this amazing position that I had to be a stay-at-home mom, which was the hardest job I have ever had in my entire life, like hands down. I was pregnant with my second son and you know I don't tell this story a lot because it's kind of emotional. I was pregnant with my second son and I was riding my bike in downtown Boise. So for those who know Boise, you know it's like bike capital right.
Speaker 2:Apparently. You shouldn't be doing that when you're like super pregnant.
Speaker 1:We'll avoid all medical advice.
Speaker 2:No medical advice and I ended up having a really difficult pregnancy. I was riding my bike there's an accident that I won't go into and it resulted with I was in the hospital and that night we really didn't know what was going to happen. Was I going to live? Was the baby going to make it All of these things? And you know, tommy, I have another baby at home who's 20 months old, and I remember being in the hospital that night and I ended up writing a letter on my phone like in the notes section of my phone to my older son, jack, and it talked about.
Speaker 2:you know, if I don't make it here all of the things that- I want you to be in the world. I want you to be. You know, do the best that you can do with your God-given abilities, right? I want you to be ABCDEFG. I want you to be all of these things because I know you have that in you. Um, fast forward, everything's fine. Uh, you know, I now have a baby and a toddler. They're 22 months apart at home.
Speaker 1:But take, take me through the emotion before you go yeah. I've had one of those experiences in my life when I I had some heart stuff and I thought it was over.
Speaker 2:Totally.
Speaker 1:It's hard, it's it's life changing.
Speaker 2:It's a pit, a pit in your stomach. It's a, it's a wound in your heart to know that. I think it's when you realize what's really important in life is in those moments and for me.
Speaker 1:When it happened to me, I had like yeah so I had, I had open heart surgery and then the next year I had it and I didn't think I was gonna die when I did that like, like the whole time through, I'm like I'm gonna be okay, I'm gonna be okay and I should have worried and I didn't think I was going to die when I did that.
Speaker 1:Like the whole time through, I'm like I'm going to be okay, I'm going to be okay, and I should have worried and I didn't. Then the next year I had a heart attack and when I got life flighted- the entire flight I thought this is it.
Speaker 2:Isn't it funny, though in those moments I mean, I don't know about you, but I wasn't thinking about myself. No, think about all of the other people, all the things that are unsaid or the things that are left.
Speaker 1:It was overwhelming gratitude, first of all as I thought through every person that I loved, and then it was overwhelming. Grief's not the right word. Sadness is the right word, Because you just think about gosh.
Speaker 2:I don't want this to end yet Not ready, I'm not ready, I don't.
Speaker 1:I don't want this to end yet.
Speaker 2:Not ready.
Speaker 1:I'm not ready. But it was peaceful for me, but it was, but, but I but I wish I would have hearing you say this now I was in a helicopter so it was hard for me to write stuff down while I had that, because it was an hour long flight. But, um, thank heaven, you wrote it down. Do you save that?
Speaker 2:You know what it down? Do you save that? You know what I? To this day, I keep looking for it. Um, but I, when I fast forward, I am, uh, in my I'll never forget. I was in our little house and I was in the kitchen and I now have a 22 month old and, like an infant, and I am pulling out my hair. I am just.
Speaker 2:You know, you forget those moments, right, the moments you forget, and I am like I've had it. I've just had it. I was just having one of those motherhood moments and I remember opening up my notes app to like, probably make a grocery list or something like that, and I found this letter and I read it and I was like, oh my gosh, I'm sitting here in my weakest moment, in my darkest moment, telling my son all of the things that I want him to do with his God-given abilities. And I know that I have that in me and I know that in my darkest moments, in my weakest moments, it's those times that you really say here are all the things that I wish I would have done or the things that I want you to do, and I knew I had to lead by example for my son in that moment that was it.
Speaker 1:Powerful.
Speaker 2:And that was when I kind of got this idea of how can I show him, how can I lead by example. And I don't want to say Red Aspen was born in that moment, but it was really kind of like the turning point for how we got started.
Speaker 1:And probably the motivation and the drive and all that. You need to do a business, because it's not easy.
Speaker 2:No, no, sometimes I think, Brutally hard right. Oh my gosh, Do you ever think to yourself if I would have known how much work it was going to be back then, I don't know that I would have done it. I don't know that I would have been able to, or maybe I would have, because I wouldn be harder and obstacles, but I I it's our first time together, but that's what makes it worth the journey, though.
Speaker 1:Right, totally, Totally Right.
Speaker 2:You go through all it's the hard that makes it worth it.
Speaker 1:It really is.
Speaker 2:Right and the people you meet along the way. You can't replace it.
Speaker 1:You can't like, there's no and it. You just got to be, you got to have the motor and go for it. So then you guys get together. Sorry, I interrupted you. Yeah, no you're great. We're here, let's get into it.
Speaker 2:You got together, yeah, and then um, okay, so we launched in October of 2017, red Aspen. Like I said, we just had a little. We had no money. We were so poor, um, and we couldn't get a loan because of the industry that we work in, which is direct sales, and so, really, we had to bootstrap everything that we have. We poured our blood, sweat, tears and nickels into this company and when we launched, I remember you know we have a video of us. We actually recorded a podcast. We have this audio from about an hour before we launched and we were just saying what's going to happen? Like, do you think we're going to look back at this day? And like, you know, what are we going to wish we'd done, or what are we going to wish we'd known, or what have we learned so far? And so we put out our cute little corner of the internet, put up our little shingle, and it has been a whirlwind experience from there. We broke even in six weeks, which was wild.
Speaker 2:Six weeks we broke even, which you know. On paper that sounds holy moly amazing, but I don't think a lot of people realize the trials and tribulations, the decisions that have to come with that right, because you say, okay, what are we going to do? Are we going to just take the money and run Like we got? Back our investment, or are we going to take that money and are we going to do? Are we going to just take the money and run like we got?
Speaker 1:back our investment or are we going to?
Speaker 2:take that money and are we going to keep going? And we decided we were going to keep going, plowing it into it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we broke even in six weeks. We launched with just seven, eight SKUs. But you know, the beautiful thing about that is, whenever you start a business like, the day you become profitable is like this, like, oh, this is going to work.
Speaker 2:It's going to happen. It's going to happen. You know I get asked all the time People are like did you know it was Brett Aspin was going to be successful? And I said a hundred percent because you have to have that faith right, if you, if you have those moments of doubt, right, then you're right.
Speaker 1:You, you create but you're smarter when you're profitable.
Speaker 2:You, but you're smarter. When you're profitable, you are a lot smarter. It makes it a lot easier.
Speaker 1:I guess You're like okay we're making more money than we're spending. Right, right, we're doing something right, so that's 2017.
Speaker 2:It's 2017. Yeah, the fall of 2017. And then, in 2018, we made a commitment that we were going to launch. So we're a beauty company, so we launched with just eight SKUs. We launched with six foam, ink and silk eyelashes. So strip eyelashes.
Speaker 2:I'll get you a pair You'll love it and then eyelash glue and a lash applicator. And then we said you know, we know we want to be a beauty company and we have these. This is my favorite part of our business. Like we are a beauty company and I think that's amazing. Favorite part of our business. Like we are a beauty company and I think that's amazing.
Speaker 2:But we have now 14,000 independent brand ambassadors all over the country who sell our products, and they are my favorite part of this business. They are these incredible women who live our mission and support our mission and, like beauty and the beauty industry is the byproduct of what we get to do right, we get to help build dreams and we get to help people. You know moms I'm supposed to probably say an income disclosure statement with this, right, but we get to help. You know moms, if it's just taking their kids to ice cream once a month, right, we get to help build community. We get to help build self-esteem, and that is such a privilege. It's awesome because it's this incredible thing that we get to do, but it's also awesome because it's this tremendous responsibility.
Speaker 1:You've got to be incredibly proud of an idea going to what it's gone to, and now the ripple effect of how many lives you're affecting on a daily, yearly.
Speaker 2:The blessings come back to me tenfold right and just gratitude and thanks, but also in watching people achieve their wildest dreams, it's the most rewarding. I mean, you know, it's the most rewarding thing to watch someone else soar and to watch them fly and become the best versions of themselves.
Speaker 1:It's the best part of being successful, right? If that's part of the ethos of why you're doing this thing, it's where true reward comes from yeah. And I know it sounds weird, but it's not about. It is about. That's what it's about. Yeah it really is I mean it's, the best part of making money is giving back and being able to give back. But I think what's harder to articulate is what you just said it's the lives affected by the industry that's created Totally. I mean, that's what makes America great.
Speaker 2:It is, I mean it really is.
Speaker 1:I mean think about the country we live in that you can get with your sister and another friend, yeah, yeah. And say we're going to do this thing and start seven years ago Totally and start seven years ago Totally. So tell us now about the explosion.
Speaker 2:So 2018 rolls around. I'm just going to throw out some numbers. So we did about $3 million in 2018. And we're still operating out of this teeny, tiny little apartment in downtown Boise. We made a commitment because we knew we wanted to be a beauty company. We knew we wanted to do more for our brand ambassadors that we were going to launch one new beauty product every single month. Gosh, that was a stupid commitment that we made. We had no idea what we were doing at the time and we did it. We held true to that commitment that one year later, in October, we launched our it's now our hero product. They're press on nail dashes so these are press on nails and we sold out of all of our inventory within five days and we pretty much looked at each other and said I think this is something, we think we've got something here. And we did. We absolutely did.
Speaker 1:So I'm going to slow you down, so for those of us that are catching up. So basically, press on nails that are sold through this direct marketing and you sold out that quickly and you're like, okay, this is we've got something, yeah, and so you know it's interesting.
Speaker 2:I think that there's a. We had put out a survey, just like earlier that year, saying what kind of products do you want? And we asked our brand ambassadors and nail products were ranked dead last. Nobody wanted those, and I think it's a really good example. You know, ronald Reagan said trust but verify, said trust but verify, and I think we all kind of had that inclination in the moment to say we think we actually have something that's different. That's blue ocean, that that we think is going to work. What's the worst that could happen? Let's try it, and so sometimes you just have to have that courage right to go do it. Um, so I think we launched with seven or eight styles, so like colors, shapes, sizes and today we launch gosh around 40 different 40 to 60, depending on the month press on nails SKUs every single month. Sometimes, like last week for Halloween, we launched 19 SKUs in a week. So it's a lot of work, but that was 2018.
Speaker 2:2019 takes us through another year of 50% growth. Great year. We moved into a little warehouse right Kind of in the heart of Meridian and gosh. I remember moving in, tommy, and thinking to myself how are we going to pay? How are we going to pay the rent on this place? I think we had 3, 3000 square feet at the time.
Speaker 2:And our products are. You know, they're this big, they don't take up a lot of room. But I remember moving in and just thinking, okay, how are we going to do this? We'll figure it out Like we'll get. We'll get scrappy. We didn't take a paycheck for three years right. Every dollar that came in, we reinvested Um and yeah.
Speaker 1:Did you take on investment or no?
Speaker 2:No, we're totally. You know what. No one would give us a loan, and so we struggled a lot. We threw every dollar that we made back into Red Aspen. We didn't take a paycheck for three years, and when we did take a paycheck it was so my sister could move out of the apartment downtown because it was full of stuff, like she had the shortest commute to work. Though it was a short commute to work, um, so and then so my partner, amanda and I could get childcare, because between us we have four little boys at that point. Um, and so it wasn't very much, but no, but today we're privately held. We get to call the shots, we don't have to answer.
Speaker 1:I was going. Isn't that like in retrospect, like? Cause such a blessing your path would have been so much easier. And now, all of a sudden, you maintain control and all the upside and decisions and ultimately value right Totally.
Speaker 2:Totally. But you know what A lot of the ethos of our company hasn't changed. We, I think people think, oh, they are all just really independently wealthy, but the fact of the matter is like, yeah, on paper that probably looks really great, but we reinvest constantly. We just built a brand new building. We have. We just launched a brand new makeup line where you know we're adding skincare skews. We it's. It's so cool Before you go, COVID hits.
Speaker 2:Okay, that's, I'll buckle up. Okay, I want to start this by saying I would never wish the financial crisis, the housing crisis, covid. I would never wish that upon any family ever again. And sometimes I feel a little bit of survivor's guilt when I tell this story, less so as we get past and into the world we're in now. In late 2019, our manufacturers in China started shutting down, and so we saw some things coming. 2020 hits. We had an event here for our top leaders here in Boise, and it was. It couldn't have been any later, because four days later, the world shut down. That also meant that salons closed nail salons closed, lash techs closed.
Speaker 2:We grew by 850% that year Again. On paper that sounds pretty incredible, but the trials and tribulations. We went from a overnight In January of that year, we did about $350,000 in revenue In April of 2020, we thought we were going to have our first million dollar month. We were wrong. We had our first $2 million month.
Speaker 1:Oh, my goodness.
Speaker 2:And trying to figure out. You know we do all of our own pickpacking and shipping. We're really firm believers that we're trying to bring jobs here to Idaho and so we do all of our supply chain, all of our logistics, that's all run here and, wow, how do you do that? And social distance it's all the problems that we all went through, right, and we're trying to support these independent businesses and lead from the front and encourage from behind and be present and show up and be with your families and take, you know, teach them and be everything to everyone. Right, and it was a lot, but we Jeannie, amanda and I, I think, really grew during that time period. We knew we social distanced from each other.
Speaker 2:You know these were really early days and we all kind of took on our functional responsibilities and then we actually did our work at night. So we would start early in the morning and then after all of our pickpacking and shipping team would go home. We would all get on a Zoom maybe, eat dinner together with our families and then get on a Zoom call and work until two o'clock in the morning and then start it all over the next day. The year is a little bit of a blur. There's a lot of stories from that year, a lot of stories, and I think we all have those. But one of the things that I'm most proud of is that, when the world shut down and people needed opportunity whether that opportunity was financial, whether that opportunity was friendship, whether that opportunity was stability in relationships that we provided a platform to support that it's an awesome story, thank you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's wild.
Speaker 1:It's wild, it was a lot it was a lot. Because you're also juggling I was reminded. It's funny, we were at a dinner last night with some people from San Francisco and we were downtown Boise and they brought up COVID. Like, how was COVID for you? I think that nowadays it's easy to like oh, it wasn't that silly. Because at the end of the day, you know it's over now and I think there was so much political controversy about it and the vaccine and everything. But now you look back.
Speaker 1:But, I reminded them I'm like well, guys, because they were kind of going down that path and I said, hey, it started in Seattle, but then it was Sun Valley, Idaho.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yes, my husband was there that weekend and yes, my husband was there that weekend and one of my best friends was the ER doc.
Speaker 1:Jim Torres was the medical director there and I remember calling him and him saying this is bad. He's like I've intubated and flown multiple people to St Luke's and Boise and we were freaked out. So you don't remember now how hard it was, not like, oh, it's all going to be okay and we have to wear masks. It was this emotional, like how do we get through this and how do we protect people and how do we not do something that's harmful to them? At the same time, we're trying to maintain our business and keep people's jobs and then for you, it's not only all of that but explosive growth in the middle of it, and how do I do it safe?
Speaker 2:And how do I do it safe? And how do I right, how do we do we it? Just hindsight's 2020, right, I mean, I think it's easy to forget that in those early days it was how scary it was.
Speaker 2:It was terrifying. It was so scary and we had legitimate conversations of okay, Amanda's leading our pickpocket and ship team and our warehouse team. If Amanda gets sick and she dies, which one of us like, these are the conversations you're having and I know that it probably looking back you're like, oh, maybe that's a silly conversation to have, but it was not silly it was not silly it was not silly in the moment, you know and you have to have the foresight as a leader to say what are we going to do?
Speaker 2:we have to have plans a through z. You have to have that, you know, know, so yeah, as it so so explosive growth.
Speaker 1:Tell us about how it's just continued to soar right.
Speaker 2:It's continued to go, and you know what? It's funny you probably feel the same way All of the years, sort of blend together but they go by like that. So you know, starting out in 2017, in this teeny, tiny little apartment broke even in six weeks, I think that was 400,000 in revenue for the year. Um, growing, growing, growing, growing.
Speaker 2:We've made the Inc 5000 list for the last three years in a row, we'll do over 40 million this year in revenue, um, and we have really big plans. You know, we think about everything in terms of our mission and for a while we were saying, you know, our mission is um. What if we were to say our goals are based around a revenue number, which I think a lot of, I think a lot of companies do, and there's nothing wrong with that. But for us, we wanted our goal to be based around our mission, and what that means to us is where we want to go. Next is we want to have paychecks in the hands of 25,000 women every single month, like that's what we're here to do.
Speaker 2:And that's what we're, that's what we're setting out to do, and that's what we're going to do.
Speaker 1:But if you can align your goals with, I mean, isn't that the best part of life? If you can create a business which you have, which aligns your goals and your, your incentives, with people and what's good for them.
Speaker 2:That's magic, it's magical. Yeah, it's magical. We just moved into a new warehouse that we built down.
Speaker 1:I've heard it's beautiful. You have to come see it. I will definitely do that.
Speaker 2:It's different than anywhere else you've seen it's. It's white and pink. We've got pink bay doors. You do.
Speaker 1:I can't wait. I'm taking you up on that. Come see, it Come see it and so, and you said something, I want to go back to. You said one of the things you wanted to do was keep local jobs yeah, and keep as much Idaho here. Talk about that.
Speaker 2:Totally Well. So I am an Idaho native.
Speaker 1:Where were you born?
Speaker 2:I was born in St Luke's downtown, yeah.
Speaker 1:So Boise.
Speaker 2:Boise, Lived all over Idaho, ended up graduating from high school out in Nampa, did a stint in Colorado for college and came back here right after. I'm an Idaho native, and so I just am so proud of our city, I am so proud of the state. I can't imagine growing up anywhere else and I know what we have is really special and I also feel this like tremendous. Um, it's not pressure, what's our responsibility? I feel a tremendous responsibility to to give back to Idaho and to do the best that I can for this state. I love it. I love Idaho. It's an amazing place.
Speaker 1:That's powerful, because not everyone has that same. You know as you you're. You're probably making decisions, if not every week, every month, on what do I do, how do I outsource, how do I? You know what's the best way to do. Easier to do it somewhere else.
Speaker 2:It would be Um but we have some incredible partners here in Idaho. You know, we've got, um, we hire so many interns from Boise state and the university of Idaho, right, um, and that gives us just so much joy to have programs set up where we partner with them. Um, idaho, is we rank really low in education? Right, we rank pretty low in terms of, like, what our workforce can do. I'm just being honest, and I think that it is the responsibility of business leaders, community leaders, philanthropy leaders to provide opportunities for people in our state so we can grow our state, so we can give back to our state, so they can prop up our state.
Speaker 1:And so that we keep them here.
Speaker 2:Totally, it's a great place If they stay here and you get this thing cranking.
Speaker 1:How many employees do you have now?
Speaker 2:70 team members at our. We call it our tree house. It's our HQ down the street from you.
Speaker 1:Why tree?
Speaker 2:house. Well, we're Red Aspen, so everything we do has a symbolism. That's who we are. So okay, here's how Red Aspen got its name. You'll love this, so we, I found out I didn't know a whole lot about trees, you know. The ironic thing about this is I actually hate the woods. I hate camping, you do. I don't like it. Like for me, tommy, camping is staying where the hotel door faces the parking lot.
Speaker 1:Okay, I've got to. The older I get, I think I'm more like you than that. Like, why do I have to sleep on the ground? I don't want to Amen to that.
Speaker 2:But what I found is that aspen trees they are actually I didn't know this they're one common organism. So what looks like an independent tree is actually connected by its root system and so it's one living breathing organism. And actually the largest organism in the world is a grove of aspen trees in Colorado and it's called Pando. So, yeah, it's really cool. It's really cool. So we thought, wow, what an amazing metaphor for our business model, because you have these women who are independent, right, but below the surface they're independent business owners, they work, they sell, but below the surface they're working as a team, right and like, what a cool metaphor. So that's how Red Aspen came to be, and Red because we honestly just thought it sounded cool, that was it, that was the one.
Speaker 1:It's okay, it's fine, all right.
Speaker 2:Pink Aspen, pink Aspen, oh fine, it's fine, all right, pink Aspen, so pink Aspen, oh fine. So yeah, pink Roll Updoors, but red Aspen, pink Roll Updoors but red Aspen you got it, that's cool.
Speaker 1:So and 70, and then, how many independent consultants are you at right now?
Speaker 2:We have 14,000. So we're on our way. You're on your way, we're on our way we do it. So we built the warehouse so that it could support that 25,000 paid brand ambassador mark for us. So, and then we'll figure it out from there.
Speaker 1:How? I don't know the answer to this question, so you shouldn't ask a question that I probably shouldn't. How's it been with your partners going?
Speaker 2:through this.
Speaker 1:Because it's not always easy.
Speaker 2:No, I am so blessed. Jeannie and Amanda, we are a kick butt team. It's not to say that we don't have our moments. But I look back on those partnership decisions and I think to myself sometimes how horribly wrong that could have gone. But at the end of the day, not only would I trust them with our business, I would trust them with my family. I would trust them with any big decision that needed to be made, and I hope that they would say the same about me. They are way smarter than I am. There's no question about it. They are so talented.
Speaker 1:They are some of the Not so sure about that, but let's keep going.
Speaker 2:I think they'd probably agree with me. They are incredibly talented and they have the grit and determination that I am proud to align myself with. They're amazing.
Speaker 1:What kind of it's it's? It's interesting hearing your story and I don't know the answer to these questions again, but not always easy, because everyone's got strengths and weaknesses or blind spots or whatever you want to call them.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And figuring those out with people that you work with every day is an interesting. I think if you talk to my partners here. They would tell you what my blind spots are like right away, but I think some of that might be luck matching up with people that compliment your weaknesses. And then there probably is part of it of saying, hey, we both we'd see the world differently. So talk a little bit more about that, Cause I think it's totally it's like not that common to get along that well for that long of a time.
Speaker 2:Well, and we are very different people, right, politically we're different, our views are different, and I think that the world has become such a polarized place. And sometimes I look at the three of us and I think to myself, if we can get along right, if we can see this like certainly everyone can get along right, like we're different, we're different people. But you said something that I just went yep, total spark. And that's sometimes we get lucky and we find that our you know, we can kind of sync together and our weaknesses and our strengths, sort of they don't overlap necessarily. And I think in business there's always an element of strategy. In business there's always an element of strategy, but then there's always that element of luck, right, and I think this is an area where we did get really lucky.
Speaker 1:In your compatibility In our compatibility sense.
Speaker 2:Yeah, amanda is how are we going to? She is a workhorse man. She will see a problem, she solves problems and she will say if I have to get from point A to point B, I will build you the system to get there. I will figure out how to code, I will figure out how to you know, solve the problem.
Speaker 2:I will figure out every nitty gritty detail that it takes, and if I don't know who has the skill, I will learn it myself. And it's this unbelievable like I can barely turn on my computer and she's over here like learning how to code. And then Jeannie has a unbelievable knack for research and diving in to the littlest, tiniest details. She has taken our product development and it has just gone from a place where we said we're going to launch a product every month and we don't really know what we're doing, to world class. She's able to build a world-class sustainable system. Um, and you know again, just rolls up her sleeves and does whatever she needs. So this is our website.
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's spend some time on this. So, for those watching on YouTube, so youtube, so um, talk to us about how this has developed, because when you start, I mean it's technology, it's part of, it's part of the whole deal, right?
Speaker 2:oh, I don't think you know what you just asked here. This is you won't load. That was a loaded question that you were bringing up. Okay, so direct sales the technology solutions available in the direct sales market are um real limited. They're so limited, tommy, and we decided earlier this year because you have really specific commission engines that you have to be able to link in with.
Speaker 2:So there's few options and our solutions are limited. So this website is actually a Shopify website. It took us two years to build and we had to link it up with a commission engine that allowed us to then pay, through our genealogy, all of our brand ambassadors and their downline, their team volume and everything?
Speaker 1:Did you have to build that database backend from scratch, or were you able to use a third party service like Salesforce?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we have like 17,000 apps connected into this oh my gosh, there's a lot. Yeah, there's a lot that's connected into this, but man, it was a two-year process. We launched this website in February of this year and it was a labor of love. Doesn't even begin to explain. Not only in January did we move into our new warehouse, we had a huge grand opening for all of our top reps and we launched this website. I can't believe that was just earlier this year. We were tired.
Speaker 2:Functioning working well and it solved a lot of problems through technology.
Speaker 1:Talk to us about that, because well, I do think you asked me when you came in here. We had a kind of a tech company we started in 2001 and back then you had to build your own.
Speaker 2:There was no back and forth. Yeah, I'm surprised you have any hair left.
Speaker 1:But every three years we had to redo it because technology would change and we'd have to redo it. But ultimately, once we got it right which probably took, but this is back during changing technology it actually became the basis for the whole company. Are you finding the technology? Even though it was painful? Two years launch, is it doing what it's supposed to do?
Speaker 2:Absolutely. We've seen our um, we've seen our average order size go up by about $3 per order, which has been amazing.
Speaker 2:I mean, that really is significant. Um, we've been able to add and that's for a number of reasons. We've been able to add upsells to this website, so when you check out, it's here products that would pair really well. We've also been able, because we have this website, to do things like paid social ads. We are able to hook up all of our texting platforms, our email platforms, basically into the website. We have a data team, so data is incredibly important to us and we are actually at a place where we can use our data, which is amazing. So we have Snowflake, which is amazing. So we have Snowflake, which is amazing. So if someone, for example, sells oh gosh, oh, it's a good example. If a brand ambassador makes a sale on her website, so she has her own website. So if you had a website, if you were an independent brand ambassador, tommy, your website would be redhasmanlovecom. Backslash, tommy A.
Speaker 1:For example, so your white label, that's yours.
Speaker 2:Totally me a for example.
Speaker 1:So your white label, that's yours, totally it's yours. It's your website, it's what you're sharing.
Speaker 2:Yes, but it's the way this is genius yeah, it's no, it's amazing genius. So I'm your customer. I'm going to go to your website yeah I'm going to purchase on your website and then red aspen, basically on our back end. One of the apps we use collects all of that data, all of that information. We pay you out in commission once a month.
Speaker 2:But I am now able, on behalf of the brand ambassadors, to reach out to their customers via email. Say they buy a skin tint. We have set up different flows so that we can send them an email and say hey, here's congratulations on getting your skin tint. It just arrived in the mail. Here is how to apply it. Here's how to remove it. Hey, are you low, cause? It's been 30 days, right, so go ahead and reorder. And they go back to the website, and even if they go to redassvenlovecom, when they use their email, it automatically attributes back to their brand ambassador.
Speaker 2:So their brand ambassador gets the sale and we also text them and again they just put in their email and their brand ambassador gets the sale. It's such a great.
Speaker 1:So you're creating an ongoing annuity on ongoing products with with constant contact with people and as long as your products are meeting their needs, you're there to just keep Wow.
Speaker 2:And it's not without its flaws. You're so smart. Yeah, oh, thank you.
Speaker 1:So if someone wants to become a brand ambassador, talk through that process and totally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so they go to redassinlovecom. We have a brand ambassador locator on the website, um, so find a brand ambassador is right there, um, and if you put in, there's a locator by. So maybe you know a brand ambassador. Okay, so maybe you've seen someone on social media have a brand ambassador. You can type their name in and they'll populate um. Or if you want to look for someone in your area maybe you don't know a brand ambassador you can search by zip code and if you are a brand ambassador that has sold I think it's $300 in the month before you'll show up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which is also like incredibly incentivizing. You know you're doing great work. Show up on the locator.
Speaker 1:This is fantastic. Let's talk about social media partners.
Speaker 2:Yes, and how big of a part of your business that is with between. But I think the beautiful piece of our business is that you know, when you share Red Aspen right, you can go live. You can do a makeup tutorial through our website. They can actually build a cart and say here's the look that I did, and they can share the cart, put it in their social stories, for example, and then the customer is like, oh, I love that look or I love that manicure. They just click on it, it populates on their website with the cart already built and the customer checks out and so it's like pre-built for them.
Speaker 2:Social media is we don't have a catalog. We don't think people need a lot of paper products in order to get started with their business, so we literally give them a website which allows them to get started day one. And the majority of our um online parties, which we call pop-ups, which are huge. They allow brand ambassadors to earn free product. Um, those are performed on, you know, instagram and Facebook. Um, there are women who are I don't know a lot about Tik TOK, but there are women who are selling thousands of dollars.
Speaker 1:My 21-old does. Isn't it amazing? It's amazing.
Speaker 2:It's wild, it's crazy we have a presence there, but it scares me a little bit.
Speaker 1:It scares me a lot.
Speaker 2:Exactly, that's a topic for another day, but yeah, it's scary for me because I just don't know how to work it.
Speaker 1:So you have, I mean, like people looking at this, it sounds easy.
Speaker 2:Tremendous, oh my gosh. And so much sacrifice.
Speaker 1:About back end work and figuring this out, and how does it work?
Speaker 2:And how does it work, and why does it work? And is it working? Did it work the way we wanted?
Speaker 1:it to Do? You have your own IT in-house, or do you?
Speaker 2:Oh, that is. We have really incredible partners. We do have our data team, which does a lot of IT work for us, yeah, and our CFO, matt, who came on in 2020. So I was serving in our CEO and also CFO role pre-2020. And I always knew that I could manage us to a certain point, but that certain point came real fast in 2020. And Matt joined the team and he's been just this incredible addition, but he is a jack of all trades, so he knows Ruby. On.
Speaker 3:Rails he knows.
Speaker 2:yeah, he's pretty amazing and so he's really been an instrumental part in taking us from what we were, I would say, in 2020, pre-2020, to where we are today. He's been just a force. So lots for him, lots of accolades for him.
Speaker 1:Unbelievable story.
Speaker 2:What's the?
Speaker 1:so 25,000.
Speaker 2:It's the goal, goal.
Speaker 1:Other goals you guys think about. Do you think about exit? Do you think about growth, youth I mean yeah, I mean you think about, like do we think about this empire?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we get asked the exact question. A lot actually, and I think we always surprise people. Um, we're having so much fun. It's incredible how much fun we're having, and I just don't see a world in which you know we're not having this much fun. Are there other things that I want to take on? Of course, right, there are things that I want to do specifically for women in the world, right. Um, I'm not a hundred percent sure what those things are yet. I know that we all have big hopes and dreams, but gosh Red Aspen has been such an amazing vehicle to be able to serve a lot of those dreams.
Speaker 1:This may sound a little corny, but like when you, when you, figure something out that helps so many people already.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I mean cause like building buildings is great.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But we have to find other ways. Through other nonprofits we create or we have a thing called teens to trades. But you have to kind of find something. That's not because in our core business it's hard to make a connection, but your life is that connection.
Speaker 2:It is that connection. You know, we were in Indianapolis.
Speaker 1:So the bigger you get and the more you do, the more people you help you get to help.
Speaker 2:It's this unbelievable honor and privilege. We were in Indianapolis two weekends ago. We have our annual girls weekend event. It's our convention and we had about 700 brand ambassadors there, which was so cool it's the most we've ever had. At an event like that and to hear the stories, I almost felt just to be vulnerable. I almost felt like people were coming up and sharing their stories with me and I almost didn't quite know how to accept those stories, Like I don't know if you've ever had moments like that where people are sharing their heart with you, jesse.
Speaker 1:There's superpowers you have that very few people do, so keep going. But you know it happens to us all the time right, Maddie, it's like hard to accept those stories. It probably is. It's probably overwhelming right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and finally, I kind of sorry I'm getting a little tangled in your cord, sorry if I missed anything up, but you know, you kind of get to this point where I had to start saying to people like I want you to know that I hear your story and I I fully am embracing your story and like it means a lot to me that you would share that with me.
Speaker 2:I've heard stories of just in one weekend I heard stories of of loss of growth, of finding yourself, of marriage, of children, of you know, partnerships, just, and and everything in between, and that's when I say it's all connected by this beauty business. That's so much more than a beauty business. Yeah, right, and yeah, beauty is skin deep. Right, I own a beauty business. I work with beauty companies all over the world and I will tell you, there is nothing more beautiful than a person that is kind and there's nothing more beautiful than a person that is going to come out and say like I'm here to support other people. That's what true beauty is. It's not just about what's on your face.
Speaker 1:Dang. This is inspiring Well gosh, thank you.
Speaker 2:It's, you know, it's our world. It's exciting to share a piece of it.
Speaker 1:So how old are your kids now?
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, my kids are 10, 10 on Monday and eight yeah.
Speaker 1:So they've been on this journey with you.
Speaker 2:They think red Aspen is the coolest thing ever and they want to have a company called blue Aspen. Oh my gosh, there they are. That was. This was a really special trip. We went to Maui for spring break. Um, it was kind of like the first trip that we had really taken as a family, probably since we launched red aspen which was so busy we've been so busy. Yeah, that's been there they are. That's their first day of school this year.
Speaker 2:It was sweet yeah motherhood you know I really want to talk to you about motherhood and you know I thought about this before I came on. I was like I don't want to put tommy in a position where he has to bring it up to me because because I know that a lot of people would probably perceive that as like well, you'd never ask a guy that question. So I'm bringing it up to you and putting it on the table. Um, I, I, you know I get asked a lot as it relates to being a mom. People say, like how do you do it all?
Speaker 2:Like how do you how are you there, how do you show up, how do you do all these things? How do you have work-life balance? And I think that it's really important to say to anyone who is a working mom, a work-from-home mom, a stay-at-home mom which I mentioned was the hardest job that I have ever had, in fact, I like to say do you work outside the home? When I meet other moms, because working in the home is a very real job there's a couple of things that I guess I just want to say to all of the audience or anyone who's watching this who, you know, is a woman, and I think that one work-life balance is a crock. Like that's not real. Like stop letting people tell you that you just have to balance your life Like no one and get rid of the guilt associated with it Totally. Just stop, right.
Speaker 2:So I like to think about that in terms of work-life integration.
Speaker 2:Like if I'm at work and I need to do something for my family, or if I'm at home and I need to do something for work, like let's just drop those walls and let's just do it, okay, let's give each other the grace to do that, and so that's really the first thing.
Speaker 2:And then the other thing that I wanted to say was being a mom is such a privilege and you cannot do it all. You can't. You can have it all, but you can't do it all, and there are sacrifices that you're going to have to make, whether that's. You know, my husband and I don't have a very traditional relationship, not out of like design or plan, but he's he's right now, he's a stay at home dad, and my partner, amanda, her husband Alex is as well, and these were not things that we like went into our marriages planning to be like, oh, you're going to be a stay at home dad. This was this, was not it, um. But I think it's really important to call out like you can have it all or, I'm sorry, you can't do every single thing, but you can have it all, but it comes with sacrifices and you have to ask other people for help.
Speaker 1:You do and I think the wisdom in that you do, and I think the wisdom in that I think um, I think somehow the brochure, early on in life, tells us lies for sure, doesn't it it? Tells us lies, and I think with with wisdom and time from people like you who have done this, listening to you and saying it's a lie. The brochure is a lie.
Speaker 2:It's a lie.
Speaker 1:And and it frees up guilt of knowing hey there are. You had struggles hearing you talk about being a stay at home mom, hearing you talk about this idea of balance, which I, which I, I personally, had a lot of guilt for a long time about that. A ton and I I had a friend that got me over that when he said are your priorities right? Then forget balance, because you're going to go through these different phases of life where as long as you can you can balance.
Speaker 1:You can say in the morning, my priorities are those two beautiful boys and my relationship with my spouse, and we are going to change over time and they're going to change over time yeah but my priorities are the same. Yeah, that is so liberating one.
Speaker 2:I think too. It's like sometimes I talk about motherhood, but you're right, you should like, you're, you should talk about parenthood in general and like balancing all of those things Like it's not going to happen.
Speaker 1:There are different seasons, right, and there are seasons that and the and the liberation for people knowing that, hey, I've got a lot of grace for myself and it's going to change. And life is short and it's long.
Speaker 2:We talked earlier about it. It's short and long.
Speaker 1:It is. It's short in the fact that it goes by so quickly, but you have time to redefine yourself and to watch these relationships grow and to watch your children go from toddlers to these little humans, to these horrible teenagers, to I haven't hit that stage yet, but I'm like bracing for it. I am ready Looking at these two. You're not. You're not going to have any problems.
Speaker 2:Oh, one of them is going to give me a room for my money.
Speaker 1:That's for sure, but it's.
Speaker 2:I think that's a beautiful way to look at it and I think it's liberating for people that always are hard on themselves for how they're making it. I mean, you can give what you can give, leave you right. You get to choose how you're going to spend.
Speaker 1:You know any hour that you're not sleeping and I'm sure there are times where you and your partners yeah, it was a grind every day for weeks and weeks and weeks it was, and I'm sure there's a lot of sacrifice. You're probably benefiting now yeah with life and it's that ups and downs and who knows what brings tomorrow, and you just deal with it. Totally, totally, but you prioritize the things that you prioritize, no matter what your days look like.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:You know, when we first started, so 2017, um, I used to bring a pack and because we couldn't afford childcare, Like literally when I tell you we don't have any money, like we didn't have any money, and so I would bring um a pack and play to my sister, our office, my sister's apartment, and the only dark room was the bathroom, and so I'd set up the pack and play in the bathroom and he would nap and I would try to bust out a couple hours of work.
Speaker 2:Right, and I've got all of these really cool pictures of um of you know, my youngest, and he's like in his little shipping USPS shipping parcel container just hanging out in the warehouse. So they've gotten to see these pieces and see things grow, and what really ignites me or makes me so excited for them, is they both. You'll ask them what do you, what do you want to be when you grow up? And they'll say we want to own businesses. Now they think that that means that they get to build a building, which I think maybe is where it's coming from. But, um, it's really exciting.
Speaker 2:I'm excited to support them on that journey, if that's what they want.
Speaker 1:It gives me the chills thinking about like like. Legacy is a big word.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is a big word.
Speaker 1:But if you think of being a mother, and loving those kids. Like redefining love, and then the example of letting them take this journey with you.
Speaker 2:Totally.
Speaker 1:It's wild, pretty powerful. Yeah, thanks for letting me talk about motherhood.
Speaker 2:I just feel like it's one of those things, especially as it relates to business, that we sort of gloss over. And I think a couple of years ago the whole thing was Sheryl Sandberg with Lean In and I'm like I can't lean in anymore. It's okay to lean back for a second. Lean back and just enjoy the time and enjoy the journey and let yourself be, do you?
Speaker 1:have any comments on the world we live in. The one thing that is just different now is I do think. I think motherhood, parenthood is hard.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I think it's, it's hard and I do see you think of social media Totally.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:Arthur Brooks is someone I follow a lot, and he had a quote a few years ago. It's like how can you not spend a lot of your day looking at people's most artificial happiness? They're, they're reels, the highlights, the reels highlights when you're in your mundane world and somehow do you have any suggestions for people that that see this and how this and how do you? How?
Speaker 2:do you?
Speaker 1:insulate yourself from the, from the sadness that it can cause it can make you feel like, oh, I've been there. I mean you're in beauty, you're in the beauty industry, right, this is you know one.
Speaker 2:I think some of my favorite influencers show up in their most authentic way. Right, and you see them and you're like, I can relate to you. Your house is a mess. Right, your, your world is a mess. Your kid is not behaving Like. I'm right there, I'm right there with you, you know? Um, I think it's. It can be really hard when all you see is the highlight reel, and I'm going to be really honest, I am probably one of the people that shows you my highlight reel, cause we only want to show the best of ourselves. Right Like, I'm looking literally at my Instagram right now and I'm like, oh, there's me on a stage. There are my kids starting their first day of school. They just got haircuts the day before, but their hair always looks like that, don't worry. Right Like, these are manufactured photos that I've put on my Instagram, but that's normal right?
Speaker 1:Well, it is normal.
Speaker 2:but you can't look at what I have here and say, wow, that's 100% of her life, and so I think, if we look at things with a different lens, it's okay to say, wow, that's her highlight reel. I can't compare myself.
Speaker 1:If I compare myself to what you've done, I will find nothing but but that's a pretty high level of operating. High level of operating Like, yeah, if you think about the way most of us work and life and whatever to be able to like, oh, that's great, but I'm sure she has. It's more normal to go, oh man, I.
Speaker 2:I don't know how we help people realize that If all of us just show up authentically, like maybe we need to do a better job. I, you know, I'm going to commit today to show up more authentically. I don't wear a pink suit every day. I normally look like the other day I was. I was in a bathrobe in my office because it was cold and that's all I could find in the prop closet. Okay, like we have a picture of it. My partner, amanda, took a picture and she was like some days you look really put together and other days you look like this right other. In other days you look like this right like maybe we should show up more authentically.
Speaker 1:I just worry because I think um well, I have, so I have a. I have a beautiful 26 year old daughter three grandkids oh, and then I've got a 21 year old and a 19 year old and and um, I look at, I just look at them and they're beautiful and they're wonderful, they're amazing, but um, you know, I think they're hard on themselves sometimes well, and I think comparison is the thief of joy in so many ways. It is.
Speaker 2:Right If you compare what you have to, and I think that that's what social media does, it. It puts out the best that you have, you know, and I think that that's where it's it's hard, because if you know, everyone's perception is the reality at the end of the day, right Like my perception is that you know, you always hang out in the studio filming, you know, but that only tells you a piece of your life.
Speaker 2:It does Right, like, how do you connect on a more vulnerable level with people? And I think if we all showed up, not just on social media but like in life, a little bit more authentically right, what a better world it would be, jessie.
Speaker 1:I think it kind of like vulnerability, authenticity, like being who you are and being kind and just helping other people. That's probably the essence of life as you get older but, it's certainly not along the journey sometimes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that you're kind of trained from a young age like, especially in business. Right, Like I went to business school, you're you're trained to be like look at the spreadsheet, analyze the data, get really into the numbers. You know, trust, trust the accountants, go with what the lawyers say, and all of that feels really cold. Right, it doesn't have to feel cold, it can feel, it can feel different. Right, it can feel like a journey, it can feel like a path that you can use your heart to make decisions. Um, you do also have to use your head. I'm not going to discount everything.
Speaker 2:I just said but you know you, you have to show up. In a way, Um, I think that at the end of the day, like you're the person who has to look themselves in the mirror, right, Some days that's easier than others.
Speaker 1:Advice for anyone listening today like kind of this, this went by been so much fun. But, but advice for someone who I mean. This is an incredible story by the way. Thank you, and it's very inspiring, but what would you leave people with?
Speaker 2:I would say that you can do hard things. I think everyone is more capable, more competent and more able than they give themselves credit for. So sometimes, when you're in a pickle or you're in a jam, just close your eyes and tell yourself that you can do hard things, because I know you can. Drop the mic End it.
Speaker 1:Thank you for coming on.
Speaker 2:Thank you for having me. It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1:Thanks everybody.
Speaker 2:Yeah.